on projects, so there are ways in which we can exert control through the cio review process, through budgeting, through approval of positions, and we're working on that, and we certainly take that authority seriously but are not sure that being punitive is always the way to go. >> which i appreciate as well. i understand how you don't necessarily want to punish departments that aren't doing the right thing, but i don't see incentives also for anyone to be shooting for higher goals, so again i don't know what will push the bureaucracy to change its culture in that five years we're not here and someone else is my seat and supervisor farrell's seat we're not having this same exact conversation again. >> i hear your concerns. >> all right. thank you president chiu. thank you cindy for the presentation and for the department of technology john.